Hello all!
I was raised in a family below the poverty line. Technically my family (and by extension myself) still fall under this distinction, though things have been steadily improving. While admittedly, being below the poverty line in the United States is different than in many other countries, my experiences have still given me a rather unique perspective on things often taken for granted.
This drove me to pursue a degree in finance with a goal to ensure neither I nor my family returns to where we were. I have interned at a moderate sized financial institution and have had several glimpses "behind the curtain" as it were in how the "western financial machine" operates.
I would love to offer any answers to questions that I can! Budget advice, the inner workings of credit, etc. I may not be a graduated "expert" yet, but am happy to share what insight I have gained thus far! I am also happy to answer questions on the experiences of poverty and the ways it has shaped my life.
XOXO
Cassie
I was raised in a family below the poverty line. Technically my family (and by extension myself) still fall under this distinction, though things have been steadily improving. While admittedly, being below the poverty line in the United States is different than in many other countries, my experiences have still given me a rather unique perspective on things often taken for granted.
This drove me to pursue a degree in finance with a goal to ensure neither I nor my family returns to where we were. I have interned at a moderate sized financial institution and have had several glimpses "behind the curtain" as it were in how the "western financial machine" operates.
I would love to offer any answers to questions that I can! Budget advice, the inner workings of credit, etc. I may not be a graduated "expert" yet, but am happy to share what insight I have gained thus far! I am also happy to answer questions on the experiences of poverty and the ways it has shaped my life.
XOXO
Cassie
Similar here - grew up below the poverty line and haven't really managed to escape it yet (though I did temporarily have enough income as a single person with no dependents to stop qualifying for a number of aid services).
I guess if I needed to focus things more clearly into questions:
I'm curious how your experience might compare to mine.
I had only a vague awareness through most of my childhood that m family was a bit more "poor" than many of those around me for some reason. I couldn't even quite understand why for a very long time, since it seemed like my parents were always working hard and always finding yet another thing that promised to somehow improve our finances. It was especially confusing when we'd visit some relatives who I think qualify as middle class. It was also really bizarre living for awhile in a community where my family was one of a very small few who were permanent residents - the rest of the place was summer homes. It wasn't until I was a teenager that I was actually told "We're below the poverty line. We're way below it." and it still took me awhile to figure out how that could make any sense. Even now in my 30s, money and the idea of some of the things some people can simply afford, or are just assumed to be able to afford at a standard, continues to frequently baffle me.
I guess if I needed to focus things more clearly into questions:
- Is there a point in your life when you became aware of your family's financial status, or did you always have a decent understanding of it?
- Have there been moments you found yourself very confused about the standards others had for what was affordable or priced reasonably; why you weren't able to participate in things everyone else got to; or why you might have been offered some opportunity while someone else you thought would also enjoy/benefit from it was denied over having too much income to qualify?
- When you were younger, were you teased over your family's situation, or over things caused by your family's situation? (For example, teased about clothes from not being able to afford nicer, better-fitting, or more fashionable/current clothes, as if you were just bad at picking clothes or something.)
- Are there any really mind-blowing moments (in terms of things like seeing someone else's norm, and illustrating experience of the scale of how different things are, etc) that you'd be interested in sharing from your life?
Your story is really interesting!
What were some small money-saving things your family did when you were a child? and
Quite often people give advice such as 'Give up the daily coffee' and 'Don't buy avocado toast'. How effective is this kind of advice, really?
What were some small money-saving things your family did when you were a child? and
Quite often people give advice such as 'Give up the daily coffee' and 'Don't buy avocado toast'. How effective is this kind of advice, really?
It sounds like you are making really good progress! Good for you! Keep at it. The slog is nearly endless, but it can be escaped. Also, good for you in investigating the aid options. They can be frustrating, embarrassing, and at the same time insufficient, but I believe strongly in their utility.
I will try and answer your questions in order, though I do tend to ramble at times (bad ADHD, Bad) *imagine that as my internal monologue*
1. It was pretty clear to me from a really young age that my family had no where near the resources some of the other kids at school had. I literally could not tell you how many oversized, hand me down, boys clothes I have worn over the years given to us by different family. Almost all of them on their third, fourth, or even more rotations through the relatives. However, the biggest moment that stands out to me was when I was about 5 years old. I went to a baseball game with my dad, (AA minor league. No chance on earth we went to an actual MLB game) while we were there he got me a hot dog and drink while we watched the game. This was essentially unheard of and I devoured it in the way only a 5 year old truly can. He then got me another hot dog. I could barely comprehend how wonderful it was. I don't remember a thing about the game, but remember those moments with crystal clarity. Particularly because when we got home I heard him and my mother arguing about money and waste long into the evening. The guilt I felt at selfishly putting our family finances in danger over food hounded me for years. (I of course did not realize that as an adult, my father was the one more involved in the decision making process)
2. One of the silliest things for me is parking. I live in a city (not as metropolitan as NYC for example, but still reasonably large with international airport, buildings over 25 stories, etc) and I will park miles away before I pay for something so insanely frivolous. (to my eyes) The most activities I missed out on were the school ones. Never being able to afford the extra curriculars I wanted to enjoy like dance or things like that. Which still irritates me because such extra curriculars can be vitally important on college applications. Thereby giving a better chance to escape poverty.
3. I was teased nearly constantly. Children are relentless brutal monsters to anyone different enough than them. I qualified for a different high school on a window application that was located in a MUCH wealthier part of the city. I was hands down the poorest kid in all the grades combined save for a half dozen or so other window applicants. These were the kinds of kids that got cars for their sweet sixteen birthday parties from their parents and lived in homes with thousands of square feet and more rooms than I have fingers and toes. Oddly enough, by this time the teasing mostly vanished. I was far more of an outlier at this high school, yet it was my inner city elementary and jr. high that held the most heartless individuals. Admittedly for a decent portion of the high school class it was more of a benign disinterest than anything else, but I managed to make some friends and fit in with a couple groups.
4. One of the more mind-blowing moments of the true monetary divide amongst my peers came around planning senior trips. I was friendly with some of the more popular kids and they were organizing a trip to the Bahamas (Atlantis Resort to be specific) in the same way that I would put together going to a movie. Honestly, considering the amount of scraping and odd jobs I would have to figure out to come up with the $5 movie ticket, they were probably planning the Bahamas trip with less care and anxiety. Needless to say my being able to pay to come along was a non-starter for me.
Hopefully that answered your questions alright! I apologize if I got off the target of any of them. I have a bit of the habit of going with the first story that comes to mind, whether or not it is actually related to the question.
I would love to hear more about your experience in a summer town! I can imagine the off season offered some respite. Unless I am off base. One of my dearest day-dreams when I was younger was to go to a summer camp and make friends with the people who actually lived there. Discovering an entirely different neighborhood than the one I grew up in.
XOXO
Cassie
I will try and answer your questions in order, though I do tend to ramble at times (bad ADHD, Bad) *imagine that as my internal monologue*
1. It was pretty clear to me from a really young age that my family had no where near the resources some of the other kids at school had. I literally could not tell you how many oversized, hand me down, boys clothes I have worn over the years given to us by different family. Almost all of them on their third, fourth, or even more rotations through the relatives. However, the biggest moment that stands out to me was when I was about 5 years old. I went to a baseball game with my dad, (AA minor league. No chance on earth we went to an actual MLB game) while we were there he got me a hot dog and drink while we watched the game. This was essentially unheard of and I devoured it in the way only a 5 year old truly can. He then got me another hot dog. I could barely comprehend how wonderful it was. I don't remember a thing about the game, but remember those moments with crystal clarity. Particularly because when we got home I heard him and my mother arguing about money and waste long into the evening. The guilt I felt at selfishly putting our family finances in danger over food hounded me for years. (I of course did not realize that as an adult, my father was the one more involved in the decision making process)
2. One of the silliest things for me is parking. I live in a city (not as metropolitan as NYC for example, but still reasonably large with international airport, buildings over 25 stories, etc) and I will park miles away before I pay for something so insanely frivolous. (to my eyes) The most activities I missed out on were the school ones. Never being able to afford the extra curriculars I wanted to enjoy like dance or things like that. Which still irritates me because such extra curriculars can be vitally important on college applications. Thereby giving a better chance to escape poverty.
3. I was teased nearly constantly. Children are relentless brutal monsters to anyone different enough than them. I qualified for a different high school on a window application that was located in a MUCH wealthier part of the city. I was hands down the poorest kid in all the grades combined save for a half dozen or so other window applicants. These were the kinds of kids that got cars for their sweet sixteen birthday parties from their parents and lived in homes with thousands of square feet and more rooms than I have fingers and toes. Oddly enough, by this time the teasing mostly vanished. I was far more of an outlier at this high school, yet it was my inner city elementary and jr. high that held the most heartless individuals. Admittedly for a decent portion of the high school class it was more of a benign disinterest than anything else, but I managed to make some friends and fit in with a couple groups.
4. One of the more mind-blowing moments of the true monetary divide amongst my peers came around planning senior trips. I was friendly with some of the more popular kids and they were organizing a trip to the Bahamas (Atlantis Resort to be specific) in the same way that I would put together going to a movie. Honestly, considering the amount of scraping and odd jobs I would have to figure out to come up with the $5 movie ticket, they were probably planning the Bahamas trip with less care and anxiety. Needless to say my being able to pay to come along was a non-starter for me.
Hopefully that answered your questions alright! I apologize if I got off the target of any of them. I have a bit of the habit of going with the first story that comes to mind, whether or not it is actually related to the question.
I would love to hear more about your experience in a summer town! I can imagine the off season offered some respite. Unless I am off base. One of my dearest day-dreams when I was younger was to go to a summer camp and make friends with the people who actually lived there. Discovering an entirely different neighborhood than the one I grew up in.
XOXO
Cassie
Claine wrote:
Your story is really interesting!
What were some small money-saving things your family did when you were a child? and
Quite often people give advice such as 'Give up the daily coffee' and 'Don't buy avocado toast'. How effective is this kind of advice, really?
What were some small money-saving things your family did when you were a child? and
Quite often people give advice such as 'Give up the daily coffee' and 'Don't buy avocado toast'. How effective is this kind of advice, really?
Cooking at home and hoarding leftovers is the first thing that comes to mind. I have a love/hate relationship with Thanksgiving (aside from my VERY strong feeling over the atrocities it represents to the indigenous peoples of the United States) mostly due to the fact that the stereotype of having "Turkey Everything" leftovers was very much my reality. Soups, sandwiches, gravies, casseroles, you name it. And my parents squeezed EVERY drop of mileage out of that poor bird. We only ever threw away the incredibly bare (usually also thoroughly boiled) bones. A medium sized (for us massive) dinner ended up lasting 10+ days nearly without fail.
As for the daily "corner cutting" advice.... It depends. I swear I'm not trying to be vague, it just really depends on the goals you have set for yourself. Such advice assumes reasonable adherence to a budget and a more or less, unchanging income.
For example:
Let's imagine a monthly income of $1000.00. (more because easy numbers make my heart happy than any attempt at realism)
Assume $700.00 of that is taken by "inflexible" expenses. These are things that will essentially never change regardless of the month or any attempts to cut costs. Rent. Utilities. Vehicle. Etc.
Assume an allocation of $250 for "flexible" expenses. Things that will still occur with reasonable regularity but maybe can be nudged one direction or another. Groceries, phone bills, clothing, these kinds of things.
The remaining *does hurried mental math* $50.00 is for you. "fun money" for lack of a better universal term. This is for things like movies, video games, cute earrings, (if you are like me) or other hobbies.
That final category is where the advice of "giving up coffee or avocado toast" come in. It is an area of expenses that are strictly "wants" and not "needs" (though I'll fight people on the earrings fitting in here.
)And this is where I say that advice usually needs to go together with a financial goal of some kind. Saving up for a vacation. Upgrading your car. Getting together enough for a down payment on a mortgage. (Obviously $50 a month would not work for these, but as I mentioned, that was more for easy math than any attempt at realism) Going several months or longer without spending that money and putting it aside instead. Then once sufficient capital has been accumulated, proceeding with whatever investment/purchase was the goal.
So for me I usually view such advice as more of a budgeting mindset than specific suggestions. Though there are of course some people so far down the other end of the financial spectrum that simply do not understand how tight monthly budgets can get. I had multiple stretches growing up where I went to bed hungry or went 24-36-or 48 hours without eating because the extra grocery money was the difference between keeping a roof and not. (The record was almost 4 days. NOT an experience I am eager to repeat. Thankfully it only happened the once.) For the people that do not understand this, such advice may actually be specific to them. Because they do not understand the mentality that budget adherence can cultivate. Like I mentioned in my previous post, one of my dearest childhood memories is simply buying a hot dog. (despite the negative aftermath) If getting a daily coffee is the mental break you require to keep going and you have budgeted to allow for such an extravagance, then you do what you need to do. Cut the corners to meet your goals in a different area of your life and above all STICK TO IT. It's a mindless, soul crushing slog. But it can be done. Most of the time.
Hope that helped!
XOXO
Cassie
No worries, I've got ADHD too and everything you offered an apology for is a thing I also do. 
Which... that actually brings up another question: How do you work your finances with the extra complications that ADHD can bring?
For me, I try to keep some exaggerated padding in my bank accounts as much as I can to avoid issues like overdraft in case I hadn't checked recently enough or forget what day a bill is supposed to auto-pay on; have been experimenting a bit with groceries since being made more properly aware of the "ADHD tax" concept (that's been more to improve my diet, but "without totally depleting my money" is very much a part of it); and currently have almost totally forbidden myself from buying certain categories of items (craft supplies, for example) until I get around to sorting out what I already have scattered around among various boxes from moving every few years while also having hoarder tendencies (because I can totally find a way to use x thing for something). It definitely still messes me up a lot - for example, ADHD is the primary thing that gets in the way of me accessing more of the aid I qualify for, since I've managed to mostly get past a lot of the shame-associations I managed to pick up throughout childhood (can't explain further without involving politics). Especially when there's things that require phone calls during standard or even more limited business hours.
Which... that actually brings up another question: How do you work your finances with the extra complications that ADHD can bring?For me, I try to keep some exaggerated padding in my bank accounts as much as I can to avoid issues like overdraft in case I hadn't checked recently enough or forget what day a bill is supposed to auto-pay on; have been experimenting a bit with groceries since being made more properly aware of the "ADHD tax" concept (that's been more to improve my diet, but "without totally depleting my money" is very much a part of it); and currently have almost totally forbidden myself from buying certain categories of items (craft supplies, for example) until I get around to sorting out what I already have scattered around among various boxes from moving every few years while also having hoarder tendencies (because I can totally find a way to use x thing for something). It definitely still messes me up a lot - for example, ADHD is the primary thing that gets in the way of me accessing more of the aid I qualify for, since I've managed to mostly get past a lot of the shame-associations I managed to pick up throughout childhood (can't explain further without involving politics). Especially when there's things that require phone calls during standard or even more limited business hours.
More about the summer homes thing
The period when we lived in that place with so many summer homes was actually pretty unpleasant in a lot of ways (but not to where it's uncomfortable to talk about, and it certainly wasn't all bad). It was around late elementary and the start of middle school for me, and it sounds like you can probably already guess some of the issues there. Trying to think how to organize this and focus on the sort of info I think you're probably interested in...
It was actually a pretty small, perpetually quite area that was pretty far from anything. For example, the only place of business in the whole, (new growth) forest-surrounded place was a golf course. Us and the other kids who lived there were also in a school district that involved about a 2-hour bus ride if our parents couldn't bring us in or pick us up from school, and we were basically the first kids picked up in the morning and the last kids dropped off after school. The area itself didn't even qualify to be described as a "town" with how tiny it was. It was just a bunch of houses; the golf course; a single park with a pond and small, kinda run-down play area; and a very minimally-managed public pool (outdoor and no access fee) with adequate showers in a building that also had, like, 2-3 arcade cabinets. Sometimes some of the other kids would come to the pool, especially when summer would get its hottest and everyone was on break, but it was pretty common to find it empty even during the open season. Honestly, I'm not sure how many of the houses actually ever had anyone living in them.
The particular house my family lived in actually had 3 floors with a deck on the middle on, a small yard, 4 bedrooms (2 large and 2 small), 2.5 bathrooms, a basic fireplace... and was probably the ugliest house in the place. The interior couldn't have been updated since the 70s or something, and from outside, the roof shape was very barn-like and the paint was one of the more unpleasant shades of green. The only thing I remember being an actual problem with the house, though, is that it had well water - which wouldn't have been an issue, but apparently there was a sulfur deposit or something in/near the well. It was a bit unnerving seeing all the sediment that would settle in the water jug we kept in the fridge for drinking, and the hot water (especially when anyone showered) always had that smell. So far as I know, it was the only house that had that issue there, too.
It was fun trying to catch frogs at the pond, though, and there were two apple trees down the road with some pretty great apples that would alternate each year which was just loaded, and a small field I'd cut through on my way home from the bus stop would often somehow grow some massive puffballs, like, just overnight, so in the right season we'd often have sautéed puffballs with dinner. There were also a couple older kids who got a little income collecting lost golfballs and cleaning out whatever odd objects or unfortunate, small wildlife had ended up in the pool filters (mostly bugs, sometimes frogs, at least once some sort of rodent relative). Also, though the pond had a lot of ducks and Canadian geese, they kept away from people and I can happily say that I've never had to learn how terrifying a good can really be. All the dragonflies were pretty cool, too.
But yeah, overall... it was a very quiet and boring place year-round.
Barely any people, no local events, not really much of anything.
It was actually a pretty small, perpetually quite area that was pretty far from anything. For example, the only place of business in the whole, (new growth) forest-surrounded place was a golf course. Us and the other kids who lived there were also in a school district that involved about a 2-hour bus ride if our parents couldn't bring us in or pick us up from school, and we were basically the first kids picked up in the morning and the last kids dropped off after school. The area itself didn't even qualify to be described as a "town" with how tiny it was. It was just a bunch of houses; the golf course; a single park with a pond and small, kinda run-down play area; and a very minimally-managed public pool (outdoor and no access fee) with adequate showers in a building that also had, like, 2-3 arcade cabinets. Sometimes some of the other kids would come to the pool, especially when summer would get its hottest and everyone was on break, but it was pretty common to find it empty even during the open season. Honestly, I'm not sure how many of the houses actually ever had anyone living in them.
The particular house my family lived in actually had 3 floors with a deck on the middle on, a small yard, 4 bedrooms (2 large and 2 small), 2.5 bathrooms, a basic fireplace... and was probably the ugliest house in the place. The interior couldn't have been updated since the 70s or something, and from outside, the roof shape was very barn-like and the paint was one of the more unpleasant shades of green. The only thing I remember being an actual problem with the house, though, is that it had well water - which wouldn't have been an issue, but apparently there was a sulfur deposit or something in/near the well. It was a bit unnerving seeing all the sediment that would settle in the water jug we kept in the fridge for drinking, and the hot water (especially when anyone showered) always had that smell. So far as I know, it was the only house that had that issue there, too.
It was fun trying to catch frogs at the pond, though, and there were two apple trees down the road with some pretty great apples that would alternate each year which was just loaded, and a small field I'd cut through on my way home from the bus stop would often somehow grow some massive puffballs, like, just overnight, so in the right season we'd often have sautéed puffballs with dinner. There were also a couple older kids who got a little income collecting lost golfballs and cleaning out whatever odd objects or unfortunate, small wildlife had ended up in the pool filters (mostly bugs, sometimes frogs, at least once some sort of rodent relative). Also, though the pond had a lot of ducks and Canadian geese, they kept away from people and I can happily say that I've never had to learn how terrifying a good can really be. All the dragonflies were pretty cool, too.
But yeah, overall... it was a very quiet and boring place year-round.
Barely any people, no local events, not really much of anything. You are on: Forums » Smalltalk » AMA: Finance Major From Below The Poverty Line
Moderators: Mina, Keke, Cass, Auberon, Claine, Ilmarinen, Ben, Darth_Angelus